How long did it take before you became "pro?"

buddha12 · #1 05-30-2008, 09:59 PM

I'm currently in that "in-between stage;" that is, I can play tunes, but I need to work them out first. I can improvise, but I need to spend forever on Band in a Box. I can write chord melodies, but they're mediocre at best (for the time being).
My question is this: with dedicated study, how long did it take you to achieve proficiency on guitar that is considered professional? What would you say is the one thing that contributed most to your progress (specifically, don't just say practice)?

derek · #2 05-30-2008, 10:49 PM

My initial question is, what are you calling a pro? Imo a pro is someone who makes their living playing/teaching/recording, etc. I gig weekly doing chord melody tunes, but it is only a part time thing for me, so I certainly don't consider myself a pro.

m78w · #3 05-30-2008, 11:38 PM

I'd say it took me 4-5 years of practicing before I could earn a living with my instrument.

And for me the biggest help to my playing was not anything I practiced, rather it was jamming and gigging regularly. That's when I really "learned" how to play.

Like Sonny Rollins says: "An hour on stage is worth a month in the woodshed"

I couldn't agree more,
MW

JohnW400 · #4 05-31-2008, 11:58 AM

Derek,

I like to think of it as "part-time Pro". It's like we're mild-mannered workers by day, but after sundown our alter ego's pop out and we become "Super Shredder". Able to leap marshall stacks in a single bound.

Just kidding. Honestly though you would be suprised at the number of monster players that you will never hear of just playing an occasional gig, local jam or even at the local music store just checking out the latest guitar that came in. Man they could hold there own with any A or B list player but don't make their main living as a musician

So I guess for Buddha12 the question is "what do you mean by PRO? Pro-fessional or Pro-ficient?"

buddha12 · #5 05-31-2008, 01:52 PM

I kind of like to keep the word ambiguous - being pro means different things to different people after all, and this allows for more variety in answers.
As for me, I'm trying to become "pro" by moving away from practicing exercises and rote memorization by working on real book tunes. How about you guys?

lkmuller · #6 05-31-2008, 02:43 PM

I actually earned a living playing shows in Waikiki from 1966-1980, from when I got out of school in 1966 until I got into the Fire Dept in 1980. Since then it's been part time for me. During my time in the Fire Dept I worked for a very successful singer here in Hawaii named Loyal Garner, who took very good care of me. We entertained in Japan, Australia, the West Coast, a couple of times in Vegas, and of course all over the state of Hawaii. Unfortunately, she passed away a few years ago and since then I've played with the Fire Dept promotonal group from time to time, but stopped that because none of them could read music, and it turned into a garage type band trip. Not my cup of tea. Nowadays, I'm just concentrating on finally really learning my instrument.

JohnW400 · #7 05-31-2008, 04:14 PM

Buddha,

That's the best way to learn. Get away from excercise and play tunes. Back when I was studying music I used to work on tunes like this:

I would take a tune like "All the things you are" and play the melody, up an octave and then in octaves. Then I would harmonize the melody with intervals.

Next the chords. First comping the changes and then doing a bass/chord comp thing. Following that, A chord melody. Then maybe attempt at trying to do the tune using quartal harmony, then compound 5th or 7th's. I learned a lot more doing that then by running scales , arps and excercises. It opened my ears up as well.

I really got this idea from my teacher who would have me work on tunes each week but with a specific scale or "tool" in mind. One week he might give me "Norwigian Wood" and tell me to use only triads to harmonize the melody. Next maybe some bop tune and tell me what scale to use to improvise over the whole tune. But the goal was to use all the technical things that we were covering. This definetly opened my ears up and was a lot more fun than just blowing notes.

Of course since I was going to college for a degree in Jazz Performance I had plenty of time to do this and plenty of excellent teachers to learn from.

One more thing, you mention your not happy with your chord melody chops. To improve this I highly recommend getting some piano books like The ones Bill Evans has out, and studying how piano players play solo. You can't play every chord but it wil sure give you some ideas. plus you can alway just grab some of the notes.

Another would be the Joe Pass books. Not the blues ones (although they are great). But your probably would be more interested in his Virtuoso I & II stuff where he plays tunes.

derek · #8 05-31-2008, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnW400

Derek,

I like to think of it as "part-time Pro". It's like we're mild-mannered workers by day, but after sundown our alter ego's pop out and we become "Super Shredder". Able to leap marshall stacks in a single bound.

Just kidding. Honestly though you would be suprised at the number of monster players that you will never hear of just playing an occasional gig, local jam or even at the local music store just checking out the latest guitar that came in. Man they could hold there own with any A or B list player but don't make their main living as a musician

So I guess for Buddha12 the question is "what do you mean by PRO? Pro-fessional or Pro-ficient?"

Hehe, that's it. Frankly, even if I was good enough to, I wouldn't want to pursue music full time at this point. It just doesn't pay well enough. I will keep my day job, and continue to play and teach part time. In a few years when retirement gets closer, I would like to ramp it up a bit more.

wizard3739 · #9 06-01-2008, 12:44 AM

I guess maybe I am considered to be a pro by my musician friends because since my retirement from the engineering world, the ONLY thing I really like to do is play jazz guitar and I do play 3-4 nights a week in different places. I don't make a lot of money with the music, but again, I am retired and don't need a lot of money. I really couldn't recommend a full-time music lifestyle for any young musician because it just doesn't pay good enough.
I have found several other musicians in my age group who enjoy playing the old standards and we really have a lot of fun and our audience is continuing to grow. Some of them are "old pro's" and some are like me and just put off the full-time music until retirement. For those of you who are elderly guitarists, think about Les Paul as a role model (He is 93 and still playing in New york city). He doesn't play my favorite style of jazz but he does play!